Winter Tire Questions

"conrader" (conrader) 11/07/2013 at 11:19 • Filed to: Tire Advice, Winter, Snow

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So, I've never actually purchased winter tires before, but with my wife driving quite a bit for work and school I figured I should bite the bullet and do it.

My plan is to buy a set of steelies and put some winter tires on there, but where to start?

1. The car in question is a 2011 Fiesta (manual!), so I'll need to buy 4 TPMS sensors? Does it matter what kind? OE? Aftermarket? I have no clue about those things or how they work...

2. How long do the tires generally last? What ramifications of driving on them when its just cold, but not snowy/icy (or if it warms up for a day or two)? I live in central Kansas, so some years we get no snow at all, and some years we get such terrible ice storms that I have to go outside to worship our house generator for keeping us alive..

3. Any specific recommended tires or things that I need to look for in a good winter tire?

Thanks in advance!

Nibbles > conrader 11/07/2013 at 11:21

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I've never purchased winter tires which, living in Denver, seems like a bad idea

I've heard that Blizzaks are some of the best winter rubber to be had

MooseKnuckles > conrader 11/07/2013 at 11:26

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You don't need TPMS sensors, don't waste your money on them for winter tires.

Winter tire tread wear varies more than a typical tire (at least in my experience). They say that winter tire compounds become affective when temperature is 5*C and lower. So even if it is cold they will provide superior grip over an all season and especially a summer tire.

Go on tirerack.com and look at tires that are specific for your car's specs, and look at the reviews and ratings. I always recommend General Altimax Artics. I run them on my RWD CTS. They are very well priced and I find them better than Blizzacks (had those on my mom's fwd Monte Carlo SS).

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > conrader 11/07/2013 at 11:27

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Cheap wheels are fine, try to find slightly narrower ones if you can. Winter tires work best when narrow to increase the pressure on the road, thus increasing grip.

Tires are tough to choose. A full-on snow tire works best when you get lots of snow, all winter long. Since it sounds like you don't have consistent snowfall, you could probably get away with a set of good all-season tires. I run Goodyear Eagle RSA's on my 2002 SVT Focus on SVT Contour wheels and haven't had any issues yet.

A good winter/all weather tires needs to have sipes, or grooves in the tread around the outside of the tire to get traction on slippery surfaces.

Also, nothing works in an ice-storm, aside from studded tires, which are probably illegal.

The Fiesta uses the same bolt pattern as the 2000-2011 Focus (4x108). Which is also the same bolt pattern as the Contour as well. So, depending on how expensive steelies are, you could possibly get some older Focus/Contour wheels that would work.

Casper > conrader 11/07/2013 at 11:28

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1 - You can do whatever you want for the TPMS sensors. If you order tires through somewhere like TireRack they can be shipped with the tires.

2- Depends on rubber just like summer tires. Softer the compound, shorter the life. Harder the compound, longer the life. The trade off is that softer generally get better traction the same as summer tires, so there's that. I know people who use winter tires for many winters in a row and get rid of them due to age rather than wear.

3- Blizzaks I have heard are good. I'm trying out some Continental ExtremeContact DWS tires this time around. They have had rave reviews from people I know in autocross who were running in the wet to people just have epic commutes in all weather... and they weren't super expensive.

conrader > MooseKnuckles 11/07/2013 at 11:28

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Awesome awesome, thank you so much. Do you know if it'll throw a code if I leave the TPMS off? I'll go check out those Altimax Artics!

MooseKnuckles > conrader 11/07/2013 at 11:30

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Shouldn't throw a code, but it will likely tell you your tires are low on whatever the normal display is for the TPMS

Doge_Supreme drives a BRZ > conrader 11/07/2013 at 11:30

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Do you really need the sensors we never got them or our 06 explorer and it just shows a little warning message but doesn't make any noise. as for how long they last, ive been running the same set of studs for 3 years but i usually switch back to my other tires when the snow stops. the studs I've been using are Nokians but i don't remember the specific model.

E30Joe drives a Subaru > conrader 11/07/2013 at 11:30

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Winter tires last FOREVER. I have a set of Blizzaks that are three years old and look new that we use on my sisters Camry. You don't need TPS either, just check the tire pressure manually if you think they are low.

You can drive them on normal roads all you want as long as you don't beat on them.

Meatcoma > conrader 11/07/2013 at 11:32

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I am in the same position as you are at the moment.

I just bought 4 stock wheels for my 2010 Camaro off Craigslist for 125. They did not come with TPM sensors(guy who sold them to me said they had them and I did not check). After looking into the prices - $60 for new TPM sensors at stealership + $80 to encode them(found out on camaro forums that my year will learn them for 0$) or $15 each used and some patience.

I think I am just going to put the tires on the wheels and not even worry about the TPM sensors, I can ignore the light for 4 months.

I live just south of Lawrence.

conrader > Meatcoma 11/07/2013 at 11:37

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Hey, a fellow Kansan! Yeah, as long as its just a light, I'd be fine with no sensors. Thats a good idea though, maybe I should look on craigslist for wheels since tire rack wants 150 for shipping..

MooseKnuckles > Casper 11/07/2013 at 11:43

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I run DWS tires on my Mazda6 all year round. These are a high performance all season tire, not a winter, just an FYI.
They are superb in the wet, astonishing actually. Pretty damn good in the snow too, but certainly not a winter tire level of performance.

JawzX2, Boost Addict. 1.6t, 2.7tt, 4.2t > conrader 11/07/2013 at 11:44

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1) TPMS: BLAH, whatever. Ford's info display is annoying and will bleep at you every 45 minutes of driving or so to remind you that the TPMS system has an error, but it's nothing more than a mild annoyance. Skip them and save ~$200. The only caveat: at least here in Vermont you can be technically failed for your yearly inspection if you have a non-functioning TPMS system... Most inspection stations will let you get away with it, but the rules do say that it's a failable issue.

2/3) depends on the tire. I really like the Dunlop Wintersport 3Ds, they wear well, have excellent dry road traction, are quiet and don't come is sizes to fit the Fiesta (booo! my ST is wearing Michelin xIce xI3s :P ) for "average" drivers if you change them over and don't run too long into the spring you should expect 3 seasons from most decent winter tires. The General Altimax Arctics are excellent when the conditions are super crappy (especially if you stud them), but they are also the antithesis of "sporty" :/ The Michelin xI3's actually have a pretty responsive sidewalls in 195/55-15 and have predictible corner load un-grip, but they have quite poor straight-line traction on dry pavement... like seriously rethink your braking points poor... I will probably not be getting another set. Damn you Dunlop! I just want Wintersport 3Ds that fit my damn car! anyone have any experience with the Pirrelli Winter Sottozero?

The user surveys on tire rack are usually a pretty good resource, even if you don't buy the tires from them...

HammerheadFistpunch > conrader 11/07/2013 at 11:45

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1. Check out tirerack.com, they will steer you right. And the usually are pretty competitive on price.

2. They will last between 2-4 seasons depending on temps, road grating, vehicle weight, etc, etc.

3. Check the reviews, go with a reputable brand and dont cheap out.

Casper > MooseKnuckles 11/07/2013 at 11:48

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They are designed with most basic snow performance features in the tread/compound as well. That's what the S stands for in DWS. They are just a little more reserved so that they don't burn out fast in dry driving and have a split tread. The biggest difference you will get going to a pure winter tire is the compound change and tread being symmetrical (generally). You could always sipe the DWS for more traction.

Here's a DWS pattern:

Here's an LM-60 tread:

conrader > JawzX2, Boost Addict. 1.6t, 2.7tt, 4.2t 11/07/2013 at 11:49

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Thank you! Awesome info

My92SSEisn'taTardis > Nibbles 11/07/2013 at 11:52

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As much as VS will rage at me (or in general) for saying this, Nokian Hakkapeliittas are some of the best rubber you can buy IMO, I haven't heard much about the Pirelli winter tires and how they perform etc. I live in Calgary, snow and ice are second nature up here (driving in it though is another topic) considering winter is 5ish months of the year at times, and we get around fine on Blizzaks (the michelin equivalent X-Ices are also a very good choice)

conrader > HammerheadFistpunch 11/07/2013 at 11:54

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Yeah, thats one thing that worries me is cheeping out, if unconsciously..I don't want to purposely buy the most expensive tire on there just out of fear of getting something 'cheap'!

Nibbles > My92SSEisn'taTardis 11/07/2013 at 11:54

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I would buy a set of Nokian Hakkakunamatatas just to say the name.

My92SSEisn'taTardis > E30Joe drives a Subaru 11/07/2013 at 11:55

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hmmm up here, Blizzaks are generally good for 3-5 winters depending on how you drive etc, past that point you lose your grip and traction significantly especially in deep snow and of course ice

My92SSEisn'taTardis > Nibbles 11/07/2013 at 11:58

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I think many people would.....

yeah, I'd probably do it

HammerheadFistpunch > conrader 11/07/2013 at 11:58

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Just check the reviews and surveys on tirerack, I haven't been steered wrong yet. I like my blizzaks, and they are usually reasonable. Just don't get the "general brand" stuff because its cheap. Its cheap for a reason. If you were getting studs and weren't too demanding im sure they are fine, but they are nearly as good as better tires

E30Joe drives a Subaru > My92SSEisn'taTardis 11/07/2013 at 12:01

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Well my sister isn't exactly E-Brake drifting her Camry like I did in my Honda Odyssey, but the winters on the Honda lasted about 4 years before they were about as useful as the pilots we had on it.

ColoradoTaco > conrader 11/07/2013 at 12:39

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I also run Altimax Arctics on my S4, very good tire for the price. I have done two Winters on them so far and they have barely shown any wear, I should be able to get at least two more.

ColoradoTaco > Nibbles 11/07/2013 at 12:42

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Eh you're fine on all seasons around town, the snow usually melts fast. I only have a set because I make so many trips over Berthoud and Loveland passes every Winter otherwise I'd just rock the same wheels year round.

Textured Soy Protein > conrader 11/07/2013 at 12:52

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I live in Wisconsin, so I have a fair amount of snow tire experience.

1. If you don't care about having a TPMS light on your dash the whole winter, you can skip the TPMS sensors.

2. To give you an idea of tread wear, I had Blizzak LM-25 snow tires for my Mazdaspeed 6, and after 5 winters of them on the car (basically from the week before Thanksgiving thru the end of March) they still had most of their tread left. So they'll last a while. It's fine to drive them on roads that aren't covered in snow, but if you drive in warmer temperatures that will mess up the rubber compound that helps with snow traction. Generally once temps start getting up around 45 you should think about going back to your regular tires.

3. There are two main styles of winter tires. Performance Winter, and Winter. The Performance Winter tires tend to have stiffer sidewalls and try to give you something resembling sporty handling non-snowy roads. Just plain Winter have softer sidewalls, and focus entirely on giving you the best possible snow traction. I've had both kinds. For my awd Mazdaspeed 6, I was comfortable with Performance Winter, but with the Miata I had before that, I wanted all the snow traction I could get so I had Studless Winter.

Since we're talking about a Fiesta here, I would probably lean towards a non-Performance tire. The non-snow handling will be mushier, but you will get the best possible snow traction. A good cheap option is the General Altimax Arctic. My friend had them for his Mazda 3 and was very happy with them.

If you want to spend more money, check out the Blizzak WS-60 and WS-70 (which is the newer version). I had the WS-60 on my Miata and they made that car surprisingly drivable in the snow. Other good options are the Continental ExtremeWinterContact, Michelin X-Ice Xi2 & Xi3.

BadMatt > conrader 11/07/2013 at 12:54

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Be careful, some tires do better on snow, on wet and others on ice. None of them are excellent at all three...

If you rarely get snow, stick with ice tires that brake and grip well on wet and icy surface.

Habitually, performance winter tires will be good for that and will not necessarily be more expensive.

http://blog.tirerack.com/blog/motorspor…

My92SSEisn'taTardis > E30Joe drives a Subaru 11/07/2013 at 12:58

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sounds about right and bonus points for drifting the Odyssey, its fun to let the back end swing out on my moms Town and Country but I can't do that too much, much less go drifting in it...

E30Joe drives a Subaru > My92SSEisn'taTardis 11/07/2013 at 13:06

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That honda was my first car (thanks dad) it was the family van and once I turned 16 my dad bought my mom a car and I got the van. I hated it at first, it was awful. But it really grew on me! 4 bucket seats, heated front seats, leather, lots of room for the ladies to hop on in! And winter drift missile haha.

conrader > Textured Soy Protein 11/07/2013 at 13:25

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Wow, thank you!

. . > conrader 11/07/2013 at 13:49

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A thing you have to remember about winter tyres is that they won't last you beyond 4 winter seasons. They may not look worn by then, but the compound deteriorates very rapidly after the second year and loses its stickiness by the time you reach season five. As a general rule, you should replace winter tyres after 3 or 4 seasons, depending now how deep your pockets are.

conrader > . . 11/07/2013 at 13:59

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3-4 years seems like (hopefully) plenty of time to save for a new set. I dislike the upfront cost greatly, though.

. . > conrader 11/07/2013 at 14:04

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Another thing to consider is getting another set of rims for your winter tyres. Storing unused tyres on rims prevents them from losing their shape and helps them stay in good condition in general. Getting a set of steelies isn't a bad idea. They may be ugly, but they're very practical, and hey, you get to keep your pristine alloys away from salt and muck.

Another thing to remember is that for snow, you want your tyres to be as narrow as possible. It might look a bit weird, but narrow tyres cut through snow like a sharp knife, and other people's cool, wide tyres aren't going to be much consolation when they get stuck.

Also, in my previous post it's supposed to say 'depending on how deep your pockets are', not 'now'. Sorry for the typo.